1 Topic by Greg L

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Topic: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

Wow, i have so much contemplation going on now with new board and sail purchases i'm soon to be paralyzed with information overload. Starting to realizes i'm endeavoring to many purchases at one time and therefore have no solid axes to focus my purchases or mind around. Yes, i have big 1st world problems.

My first question here is, does the new cut out clew profile /reduced boom length of newer racy sails allow improve board range. My question is better explained by asking, if my current board maxes out at 7.5m on an older sail will a new reduced boom (GP2) sail make the board 8.5m appropriate ?

Next. I have a ltd construction board touted to do Freeride/Freestyle/and wave well. I am selling the board due to its inability to stop spinning out at higher speeds. My question here is, does a board that is designed with everything in mind do nothing well ? Further in a sub 110L board is the cost of ltd construction worth it for a 1kg gain with a 245lbs rider ?

Last edited by Greg L (2012-03-01 09:37:57)

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2 Reply by redsurfbus

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

I am not sure the new cut out clew improves board range, I would suspect that it only does in terms of progress in overall sail design and improvements over the last few years. Modern sails do without a doubt.
The newer race design sails with more stability will work better than an older freeride sail on the same board when looking at max sail size for the volume/width.

For example, I used to have a North x-type 7.8 (0cam) from 07, it was the sail I learnt with and covered a lot of miles. When I tried to use this with my Kode112l it never felt right, always wanting to luff up and I never felt comfortable with it, yet it was perhaps the best all round board I have so far used. When I tried it on my Mistral SLRD 95l (59cm) there was no chance, it all felt completely wrong. I replaced the sail with a Tushingham 7.6 x15, a much more powerful sail, this was perfect on both boards (even though the max size stated was 7m on the mistral) and showed the Kode could easily take a bigger freerace sail. I think the stability was the key, with the North the centre of effort moved around a lot, with the tush the c-of-e was stable and only shifted as I adjusted outhaul.........With my new Hot GPS the c-of-e is more stable than any of the above and hardly shifts as outhaul is cranked on or off, it is also lower and the foot up to boom does not move even in the heaviest of gusts!

For your board question, my kode did everything very well, I loved the board and only sold for a dedicated slalom which is about 2 knots quicker for me in the same conditions. Have you tried a different fin? My kode span out with the supplied fin every time I went over 28knots, never span out with a real fin bought for purpose......in fact I suspect you have a kode from your description.....try another fin!

As for cost, you make your choice, Boards did a test and although most people liked the lighter ones they had virtually no difference in speed/style/wave riding. In my experience the ltd construction is often stiffer and will be more tiring to sail all day for a weekend warrior (this is what I found with my Mistral). The flex in the wood/glass is very beneficial for comfort over a long time, especially if you dont get the chance to sail every day.

Hope that helps.

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3 Reply by Jeffrey Henderson

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

What is "ltd"?

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4 Reply by uwe

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

ltd means a limited- (lighter) constrution of the board

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5 Reply by npiankov

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

Greg, have you tried different fins with that board? Especially at high speeds, very little of the board is touching the water - you are riding the fin. I would expect that to have more to do with a spinout than your board. (Of course, there is also a technique issue always floating in the background).

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6 Reply by Geoff

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

Greg,

I'll suggest 2 things before selling the board:
1) use a 'green scrubber' pad (for kitchens or workshops) to rub off any paint jobs from the fin maker, and
2) if that doesn't work try an aftermarket fin (which also will need the paint rubbed off with a green scrubber).

I would strongly suspect the fin here.

OEM fins are OK, but rarely great.

The paint jobs disrupt laminar flow, especially at high speeds, and lead to poorer performance than the designs merit. Basically you should rub off the paint jobs on all of your fins. (It's a PITA...).

Last edited by Geoff (2012-03-02 16:28:48)

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7 Reply by redsurfbus

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

If the fin is a drake, you will be rubbing for a very long time. I did it with the one supplied with a kode, still span out at 28knots every run, traded it in for a select, brilliant fin until I hit something, then was never the same again. Now Black Project every time for me, rarely spin out and are pretty much indestructible (I hit a sunken boat at 25knots, needed to sand the leading edge just to smooth over the small dent, fin still works fine).

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8 Reply by Greg L

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

Thanks all for your thoughts and concern, the board is out the door done hopefully soon. Andy at Wind NC in Hatteras has been really good with letting me try anything/everything to overcome the board issue. We have had the tape measure out, looked at my already modern stance. Swapped so many new fins i cant count. Gave it good effort. Bottom line is the manufactures very well known rep admits the board design is not suited for my 245lbs. and the company tried something new (funky tail) and has learned and moved on from that design. It's shape was apparently too short for the rocker and my weight. This flaw doesn't seem to be apparent to lighter riders. Down side is i'm getting stuck with a LTD construction board i paid a lot for that i cant sail. This is a well known manufacturer that i have other boards from that i love so my intention isn't to throw mud just inquire into my next steps. I mentioned LTD to allow those to connect the dots on brand if they wished.

Next steps. I'm looking for a high wind board for my 245lbs.of weight. Sails 6.5 to 4.5 are its intended range for use is mainly Hatteras NC sound-side psycho chop. When i'm on a sub 100l board and a 5.5-4.5 most are in the 3's. I would like this board to be reliable when conditions and possibly i am not.  Would like the board to be fast with strap options inboard and on the rails so i can tune the board a lot. After this last board i am shy on the FSW designs so am considering a Tabou Rocket 105 - 95L. I love my 115l Rocket which gets a lot of 5.5 use when there are holes making the R95 the natural choice. The R95 is a slalom like shape at only 58cm wide so am concerned this board is to racy for the 4.5 stuff and will not be good for my weight in average 6.5 holes. 6.5-5.5 Demons and Fires will get the most use on this board.

As i will be taking a hit on this board and My 115 Rocket is my bread and butter board i am considering a deal on a new  2010 94 Kode. Does anyone have any thoughts base on my comments and needs on this board or others ?

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9 Reply by Geoff

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Re: Shortened booms on racy sails, and other 1st world problems.

Got it.

I think I've said it before, but it's probably buried somewhere so I'll say it again.

My 58.5 cm wide *B Kombat is my fave board, not because it's high wind but because it is far and away the easiest board I've ever had to gybe. Ever, of any size. On Seneca, on Erie, on Ontario, and soundside in Hatteras, it's pathetically easy. It's my smallest board, but when on it my planing exit percentage is near 100%. That easy. It's true in waves or voodoo chop (slightly less in voodoo chop). I've decided that it's basically because the board so completely communicates to my feet what it's doing that I have to pay little mind to what it's doing and can focus totally on the wave and my rig. Also, I would say that when I look at the wave and change my foot pressure it's immediately apparent to me what the board is going to do. Tight, wide, slashing, it's very readable. I love it, because it means I can totally focus on sailing. When I can get on my Kombat, I know everyone is going to get a clinic. Maybe it's just me, but I find my Kombat that transformative.

In contrast, I've had a variety of other boards, and I noted JH's comment on my joke about his excellent aerial (another thread). He is right on: he can't imagine Robby riding a *B or a SuperFreak ME. I don't know Robby, but me neither. I've ridden and owned several Naish boards and sails, my all-time fave was the Mistral Naish 8'7". Unbelievably fast, unbelievably light, unbelievable air, but you'd damned-well be ready to drive it (and yourself) to the limit. Hard hard hard, sheet in, carve insanely hard. That's what Robby's boards are designed to do; if you have a Naish board (or rig), in my experience you will be greatly rewarded for driving to the extremes of your abilities - carve hard and tight, sheet-in and go faster than you thought possible, pull up and go for huge air. Do that, and a Naish board works phenomenally well. But you've got to sail like Robby. Hey, it's his board, it only makes sense that you need to ride it like he does! If you haven't got the gonads for it, then don't get a Naish!

The Kode, and I would daresay all *B boards designed by Tiesda You are much less radical and smoother handling (based on my riding several of his boards). Tiesda You has a much more gentle touch to his designs. It's like comparing a Dodge Viper to a Porsche Carrera. Very different, not that one is better or worse, just very different. I haven't ridden the new Kodes, but having ridden a few *B products I think you'll find it worth a try if being able to focus on what you're trying to do (rather than harnessing the aggression to go for it), then I suspect the Kode will appeal.

What my Kombat doesn't do is jump nearly as well. It's only OK in that realm. Bummer...I do love to get big air...

Last edited by Geoff (2012-03-04 17:42:59)

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